Go Back   Natural Medicine Talk > Health > Dentistry

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-12-2011, 03:08 PM
someguy someguy is offline
Guide
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 325
someguy is on a distinguished road
Default Food keeps getting stuck between back teeth causing pain/discomfort

I dunno what changed but the past few months I keep getting food stuck between the back molars on one side. Never used to happen before, I dunno if theres more space between those teeth now or what but its becoming a nuisance.. almost every time I eat I get food stuck there and then I floss it out but its in the back so its hard to get to and the gums are sensitive and I feel like it keeps getting irritated.. how can I fix this?

I dunno why it would suddenly start happening all the time.. in the months previous I was flossing a lot, after every meal, maybe that increased the space between those two teeth?

it hurst right now
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-13-2011, 02:47 AM
Ted_Hutchinson's Avatar
Ted_Hutchinson Ted_Hutchinson is offline
Lecturer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,877
Blog Entries: 4
Ted_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura aboutTed_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura about
Default

Do be aware that low levels of Vitamin D3 and/or Melatonin levels are implicated in gingival and periodontal disease.
If your saliva and immune systems don't have the means to secrete the appropriate amount of natural anti inflammatory anitmicrobial agent then your gums will get inflamed.

Melatonin
Vit d gingival
Vit d periodontal disease

Obviously the more pathogenic bacteria in your oral cavity the more likely you are to get trouble. It may be worth using Xylitol chewing gum or sweeteners to reduce pathogenic bacteria in your mouth.
Iherb are probably cheaper than Zellies but Zellies has links to the science.
Use $5 discount code WAB666 if you are new to Iherb and want to import to the UK as there shipping is generally cheapest, for USA check google/amazon first for price delivered comparison.

Melatonin contributes to protecting of oral cavity
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-13-2011, 10:24 AM
someguy someguy is offline
Guide
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 325
someguy is on a distinguished road
Default

Thanks for the advice Ted!

Its odd, because.. I take way better care of my teeth these days then I used to.. I floss everyday and brush every day at least once.. and I wash my mouth with a herbal mouthwash thats good for the gums etc..

But I recently got my teeth cleaned and the dentist woman was like "you need to floss".. and I was like "umm I floss after EVERY meal" and she was like "well your technique must not be very good" ..

it was just suprising though because I almost became obcessive about dental care and expected to have perfect gums etc..

So now im realizing I need to do more .. Yea good quality sleep and vitamin D seem to be criitical to most health problems! Pretty wild..

I think Sleep is so important.. for most of my life ive stayed up pretty late (2 AM) but im working on going to bed earlier.. my goal is ultimately to go to bed at 10 PM and wake at 6 AM, apparently thats the best time to sleep.. I need to work on getting outside more.. I live in sunny southern california so it helps.. Im not really taking a Vit D supplement BUT I do drink a vitamin rich shake most days that has .. ooh just checked only 400 IU of ergocalciferol which I suppose is D2. Maybe I should throw in an extra 1-2K of D3 a day just to give me a boost.. I'd like to get my vitamin levels checked anyway I should do that.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-14-2011, 07:28 AM
Arrowwind09's Avatar
Arrowwind09 Arrowwind09 is offline
Standing at the Portal
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,554
Arrowwind09 has a spectacular aura aboutArrowwind09 has a spectacular aura about
Default

moxsum, with all the other symptoms that you have it seems to me that you are still struggling with a pathogen overload.. you keep having one issue after another... if you would only take mms....but I know... you don't like the idea of it...yet you continue to struggle.
__________________
"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." Marcus Aurelius
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-14-2011, 07:57 AM
someguy someguy is offline
Guide
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 325
someguy is on a distinguished road
Default

hey arrow, thanks for your concern but im really not having many issues anymore. At least I dont think so.. or maybe my attitude has just changed.. but in general I feel pretty good, im definitely not sick or having bad problems - more like just fine tuning some things..

I just got the carlson vitamin D 2,000 IU drops which I will start taking.. like on todays, its gloomy outside.. but then I had a thought..

Surely its not natural to have high vit D levels all year round?? I mean.. thats why the seasons exist right? Wouldnt it be "natural" to get less vitamin D in the winter time if we were all living outside in nature? So is it normal to artificially inflate our vitamin D levels all year round? In nature animals go through changes a long with the seasons, bears hibernate all winter long etc. Humans too are supposed to be effected by the seasons, but because we live inside all year with artificial light are connection with nature/seasons is all messed up.. is taking vitamin D supplements like living with the light bulb?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-14-2011, 01:40 PM
Ted_Hutchinson's Avatar
Ted_Hutchinson Ted_Hutchinson is offline
Lecturer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,877
Blog Entries: 4
Ted_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura aboutTed_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura about
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moxsum View Post
Surely its not natural to have high vit D levels all year round?? I mean.. thats why the seasons exist right? Wouldnt it be "natural" to get less vitamin D in the winter time if we were all living outside in nature?
But you have to understand what the levels of 25(OH)D would have been if you lived near naked outdoors throughout the year in a tropical latitude. It wouldn't just have been the 60ng/ml mark it would have got well over 100ng/ml. So at it's peak it would have been 100+ and it's nadir around 50ng/ml.
We don't get anywhere near the lowest of those levels nowadays. Your 2000iu will barely get you above 40ng/ml if your lucky and get outside with your kit off.

Quote:
So is it normal to artificially inflate our vitamin D levels all year round?
BUT YOU AREN'T INFLATING YOUR VITAMIN d status.
You're barely getting above deficiency status. You not even meeting your daily needs.
If you were female and breastfeeding you wouldn't be providing vitamin D replete breast milk for your baby. Surely you grasp the idea that human breast milk should be a complete food ideal for human babies, Paleo mum's didn't have D,DROPS to provide the D3.

Quote:
In nature animals go through changes a long with the seasons, bears hibernate all winter long etc
Sure that's why we have the capacity to store vitamin D3.
Look at 40ng/ml no one has any stored D3
It's only when you move above 40ng/ml can you measure strored D3 in tissue cells.


Quote:
. Humans too are supposed to be effected by the seasons, but because we live inside all year with artificial light are connection with nature/seasons is all messed up.. is taking vitamin D supplements like living with the light bulb?
Certainly NOT.
You haven't got anywhere near the levels that early humans would have normally achieved.
Your pathetic 2000iu/daily isn't going to meet your daily needs let alone allow your body to actually store D3.
Sure I think it is natural to have a reserve of D3 build up in the summer and for that to decline over the winter. But I can't live naked all summer, The neighbours wouldn't like it nor would the shops, pubs restaurants etc. It isn't possible in modern society to live naked throughout the summer so the best you can do is get 30mins full body exposure in the privacy of your own garden. But don't kid yourself that that combined with your pathetic apology for an effective strength vitamin D3 supplement is going to get your levels above the levels at which storage of vitamin d3 in cells actually is measurable.
You're kidding yourself.
It won't happen because it can't happen.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-14-2011, 10:18 PM
someguy someguy is offline
Guide
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 325
someguy is on a distinguished road
Default

So what do you recommend 10,000 IU a day supplement?

Also, if your white, your ancestors were likely not living in a tropical climate.. most white people are from northern countries, like northern europe/russia/canada where theres less sunlight and they wore skins and furs to cover there bodies so they didnt freeze. But I suppose many of those cultures were eating fish.

Im just playing the devils advocate here

Is it fine to take vit d2 and d3 at the same time? Because in my shake I drink in the mornings it has 400 IU of D2 then if im taking 2000 IU D3 is that ok?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-15-2011, 12:31 AM
Ted_Hutchinson's Avatar
Ted_Hutchinson Ted_Hutchinson is offline
Lecturer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,877
Blog Entries: 4
Ted_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura aboutTed_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura about
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moxsum View Post
So what do you recommend 10,000 IU a day supplement?
Initially if you haven't been taking an effective strength supplement or been getting full body sun exposure, But you do have to have a 25(OH)D test after 3~6months to see how your body has responded and adjust the amount according to the level achieved aiming at 60ng/ml.

Quote:
Also, if your white, your ancestors were likely not living in a tropical climate.. most white people are from northern countries, like northern europe/russia/canada where theres less sunlight and they wore skins and furs to cover there bodies so they didnt freeze. But I suppose many of those cultures were eating fish.
The most logical reason why those who lost hair and those whose skins were the palest survived best in the most northerly latitudes is because during the summer these folks STORED the most vitamin D3 and so had the greatest natural antibiotic, anti-inflammatory antioxidant reserves. But you only have significant reserves above 50~60ng/ml under 40ng/ml and your just meeting daily needs.
The Inuit survived the long winter because they developed a taste for game/fish/plants/seal/whale fermented in seal oil in pits in the ground combined with the vitamin d rich caribou meat (they graze on vitamin d rich lichen) it's estimated they obtained more than 6000iu/daily/D3. Now if that was the RDA we would see a reduction in chronic illness.

Quote:
Is it fine to take vit d2 and d3 at the same time? Because in my shake I drink in the mornings it has 400 IU of D2 then if im taking 2000 IU D3 is that ok?
D2 speeds up the rate at which vitamin d is used up by the body. The more D2 you take the faster your body disposes of the vitamin. I don't take any D2 and would never suggest that anyone takes any ever. I can't see the point. However in relation to the 2000iu it's a relatively trivial amount but this is a NATURAL HEALTH FORUM and we should be encouraging the use of NATURAL (for humans) forms of vitamin d3.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-18-2011, 01:40 AM
Ted_Hutchinson's Avatar
Ted_Hutchinson Ted_Hutchinson is offline
Lecturer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,877
Blog Entries: 4
Ted_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura aboutTed_Hutchinson has a spectacular aura about
Default More Evidence Vitamin D Boosts Immune Response

Vitamin D-Mediated Induction of Innate Immunity in Gingival Epithelial Cells
Quote:
Human gingival epithelial cells (GEC) produce peptides, such as β-defensins and the cathelicidin LL-37, that are both antimicrobial and that modulate the innate immune response.
In myeloid and airway epithelial cells, the active form of vitamin D3 [1,25(OH)2D3] increases the expression and antibacterial activity of LL-37.
To examine the activity of vitamin D on the innate immune defense of the gingival epithelium, cultured epithelial cells were treated with either 108 M 1,25(OH)2D3 or ethanol for up to 24 h.
A time-dependent induction of LL-37 mRNA up to 13-fold at 24 h in both standard monolayer and three-dimensional cultures was observed. Induction of the vitamin D receptor and the 1-α-hydroxylase genes was also observed. The hydroxylase was functional, as LL-37 induction was observed in response to stimulation by 25(OH)D3.
Through microarray analysis of other innate immune genes, CD14 expression increased 4-fold, and triggering receptor expressed on myeloid cells-1 (TREM-1) was upregulated 16-fold after 24 h of treatment with 1,25(OH)2D3. TREM-1 is a pivotal amplifier of the innate immune response in macrophages, leading to increased production by inflammatory response genes.
Activation of TREM-1 on the GEC led to an increase in interleukin-8 (IL-8) mRNA levels.
Incubation of three-dimensional cultures with 1,25(OH)2D3 led to an increase in antibacterial activity against the periodontal pathogen Aggregatibacter actinomycetemcomitans when the bacteria were added to the apical surface.
This study is the first to demonstrate the effect of vitamin D on antibacterial defense of oral epithelial cells, suggesting that vitamin D3 could be utilized to enhance the innate immune defense in the oral cavity.
Science News article based on press release.
More Evidence Vitamin D Boosts Immune Response

While of course vitamin d won't stop the food getting stuck it will reduce the potential for infection.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-19-2011, 01:21 PM
someguy someguy is offline
Guide
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 325
someguy is on a distinguished road
Default

Thanks ted.. ive been upping my dose of vitamin D.. taking 4-8 K a day now, this week has been grey skies and ive been indoors a lot..

Anyway - back to my teeth issue - ive looked it up and apparently its called an "open contact".. basically theres a slight space between the two teeth.. normally when I floss I have to wedge the floss in between the teeth, but on these two teeth it glides through without much effort.. its getting to be annoying, most times I eat, especially meat I get some food painfully stuck there and tehn I have to floos it out and my gums are left irritated.. this could also be why the last time I had my teeth cleaned the woman said I needed to 'floss more' .. apparenyl my gums were bleeding a bit, but I floss all the time, so it could be this "open contact" is causing some chornic irritation to my gums.. clearly this needs to be fixed soon - chronic gum inflammation is bad news. But at the same time, I Really dont like western dentists, they cause way more health problems then they fix.. im trying to think how they could fix this.. either a brace to bring the two teeth closer together again - or some filling to stop food getting inbeetwen the teeth... the problem is, its the 2 farthest teeth in the way back of my mouth.. putting braces back there must be difficult and having them working that far back in my mouth freaks me out a bit.. then if its a filling my fear is the type of material they would use could cause issues.. hmmm guess I need to do more research..
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 11-19-2011, 04:41 AM
yeo yeo is offline
Observer
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1
yeo is on a distinguished road
Default

hi,
have u found the "cure" for the food getting stuck problem? I have the same situation here. Same comments abt maybe i hv not floss correctly. My dentist says, best way is to floss aftr every meal and if the situation is causing me alot of discomfort, he recomended me to do a crown on both the molar to reduce the gap, which i think is too costly as the fix.. or to pull out the last molar. Am seriously thinking of going for another dentist opinion.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-22-2012, 11:42 AM
7Destiny 7Destiny is offline
Explorer
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 72
7Destiny is on a distinguished road
Default

A water pik helps! You can get one on amazon for about $45. If you haven't looked in awhile, they have smaller machines now. I really like mine.

My current dentist told me I am doing all I can in terms of cleaning but I have a ph problem. Previous dentists have also mentioned that some people have saliva that makes them more prone to cavities.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-19-2012, 06:27 AM
rpguy4 rpguy4 is offline
Observer
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1
rpguy4 is on a distinguished road
Default Same condition - Water Pik definitely helps

Exact same situation - in the space between the back two molars, crown on the very back molar, and "formerly" a silver filling on the tooth next to it. My dentist replaced the silver filling, which btw was slightly fractured, and tried to build the space up between the two teeth with the new filling. Didn't work. My dentist claims the crown is a good fit, however, I do feel like that the food is actually getting lodged slightly under the crown or its getting caught on the edge of the crown. Don't know. Dealing with this for the past 6 months, and its getting ridiculous.

(A Water-Pik certainly will do the job too.)

I know as soon as food gets between the teeth. If I let it set there for more than a few minutes without flossing, brushing. or Water Pik, it hurts/aches for hours afterwards. My dentist is telling me my teeth have shifted slightly since the crown was put on the back molar, and that I may need a new crown to fill the gap. I might add that I wear a night guard on these teeth to protect them from my grinding(Bruxism).

The other thing, I literally just tried, was swirling around in my mouth, some hydrogen peroxide and holding it there on the back teeth. That really seemed to knock down the aching or discomfort. Of course, don't swallow hydrogen peroxide.

For vitamin D I take a sub-lingual from Superior Source - 10,000 IU. I take two a week, and within a month my vitamin D levels were back up around 80. Sub-lingual gets absorbed much faster by your body, and is the way to go for fast absorption.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-19-2012, 10:10 AM
kind2creatures's Avatar
kind2creatures kind2creatures is offline
...elusive dreamer
Wiki Editor
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 5,633
Blog Entries: 44
kind2creatures is just really nicekind2creatures is just really nicekind2creatures is just really nicekind2creatures is just really nicekind2creatures is just really nice
Default

A proxa brush is an easy thing to keep in your wallet, and just poke out the food at the gumline and rinse.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-26-2012, 04:50 PM
the_man the_man is offline
Observer
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1
the_man is on a distinguished road
Default Best solution Ive found is GUM!

I chew a lot of gum afterwards, its become more helpful than flossing. It's actually become a neccesity for me to have everywhere I go now, plus, there are numerous benefits to chewing gum. But you have to be careful which gum you chew cause it has to strong and firm to get into your teeth and push out the food particles properly. Ive used many types of gum and the best kind that Ive found is Trident. the bubblegum flavor. (pink package). Its also sugar-free.
Reply With Quote
Reply
Please reply to this thread with any new information or opinions.

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Back Pain (Exercises) kind2creatures Bones & Muscles 3 02-09-2012 05:16 PM
Wrist pain/discomfort randomrs121212 Bones & Muscles 3 01-02-2011 10:47 AM
teeth and gum pain!!! ASAP favaloro13 Dentistry 2 06-15-2010 07:27 AM
Supplements Ease Hip Dysplasia Pain/Discomfort kind2creatures Pet Health 0 01-23-2010 01:44 PM
How I cured my lower back pain. Iggy Dalrymple Bones & Muscles 3 03-24-2008 04:25 PM