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Old 03-08-2009, 04:58 PM
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Default Preparation and Living for Today

Last September when I saw this economic crisis coming down I freaked. I knew I was not ready. I looked at my kids and saw they were not ready. As time goes by my confidence in the economy has not increased. So far my state is doing much better than others and my husband thinks I'm a nut. Guess I freaked more than perhaps I would have but he was not here to talk me down, being away, building our retirement home in another state all summer and into the fall.

I actually knew it was coming starting about 10 months earlier from the August crash due to the watchers out there, telling me what they see.

It's in their predictions, it's one of the reasons that I got so into MMS and promoted it and pushed it and dwelled on it for so long. I just thought that at this particular time people could be greatly benefited if they had bottle to hang on to for come what may.

So I worked on preparation. I am still working on it.

I don't know what will happen as we go forward as a family and as a nation but I suspect it will get very very bad for some, it already is, for others, they may do better.

I feel that this is not necessarily the time to save money. It is time to make sure you have what you think you need to survive and we have been focusing on that. I know many people have no money to do this and I fear the worst for them.

On the other hand I live in the moment. My husband retired last year...so we were getting ready to scale down anyway...and we were planning on building a house on a piece of land we have and he is building most of it with his own two hands other wises we could not afford our dream. The plan was to build the garage with a studio up top and we got most of that done this past year. Building the house was contingent on selling our current house. Now we know we will not get what we were planning to get for it...so we may never get that house built...or maybe scale it down to about 900 to 1,000 square feet if we are lucky... worst case senario, we retire to the the 500 sf studio over the garage till we are to dam old to climb the stairs.

I know I have a propensity for fearing for the worst...but life has taught me that the worst can and does happen, and you never know when or to whom, so I am getting ready. Then if nothing happens you get to ride on the preparations you have made.

I don't know how bad things will get....but there are homeless people now in the city of Tokyo, unheard of before. Tent cities are growing in LA and other areas of the country. There has been rioting in China. Mayors and congressmen are telling people not to vacate their foreclosed houses due to increasing homelessness and vacant housing being trashed. We are loosing 600,000 jobs a month fairly consistently.

On the other hand I keep hearing reports about how bad the economy was back in the 70's and 80's. I was blissfully ignorant of these facts and have been most surprised these past few months finding out these economic details. I was so poor at that time and so self absorbed in my own life's exploration I had no clue what was going on so I wonder if this is just media hype I am becoming victim too.

But the press tells me otherwise.

I see the medical industry collapsing. More and more hospitals are operating in the RED. They do not speak of this on the news (unless you listen to NPR) but as more and more people loose insurance due to job loss the insurance companies will fail...If people are not paying taxes how can medicare, medicaid and now, new developing plan for government backed insurance go on? The drug companies are positioned to have terrible losses...not that I care for them but is a barometer of the general state of the economy.
http://www.thefactoringblog.com/half...ng-in-the-red/
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...,3182541.story
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...32/ai_65020068
http://www.graham-center.org/online/...ed-budget.html



and they tell us there is a future in health care work.. I think someone lies.

Most of our auto industry is going to fail.

I am most concerned for the T bill and bond industry. If people, and it is mostly China and Arabia that buys the vast majority of these financial products, if they stop buying we are doomed. They buy our debt. If
they call it in and want to cash out we are financially doomed. Major construction projects have halted in Dubia area due to lack of funding.
Arabia is having a hard time as they have expanded their economy on oil profits, and now world demand is way way down due to failing industry.

I am thinking the dollar will collapse. It is strong now but strong compared to what? the euro? The euro is teetering... The peso choking...
I think the us dollar is strong only due to belief, belief that is based in wishful thinking... when the truth comes into full focus you better have your gold and silver and trade goods ready.

Of course no one will come to move you out of your house. Your credit card card companies will vanish. Banks will fold. They can't possibly put everyone in paupers prison.

I don't know about you but if we are not able to collect the social security we have paid into for 40 years we will be up the creek. Perhaps they will just print more money and no one will notice

Look at Ice Land.

What are they going to do, The federal reserve?... just keep printing money.? Most people are not aware that the Federal Reserve threw 800 billion into the banking system last september, and that is above and beyond the TARP money. We didn't vote on it. they are their own entity who just prints money. We have no say in the matter.

I am also quite curious about what will happen with agriculture this year. Will government subsidize them? Will farmers be able to get loans? We shall see what we shall see.

So, I am working on preparing for the worst. I recommend that others do the same. I live in a Mormon city and Morman's are supposed to be prepared for the worst even when things are great. I have learned a few things from them. It is a lifestyle choice for many, and good common sense and an understanding of history tells us that a self sufficient person leaves no stone unturned and can weather what storms may come.

So there you have it. This is what I have been chewing on daily for over a year now and literally choking on since September.

I do pray I am wrong. I hope I ill advise you all. That we shall never need such preparation and concerns. I do hope that you all get to mock me and make fun of my paranoia and that others get the last laugh and that I will be able to laugh with them for my foolishness.
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Old 03-08-2009, 06:27 PM
D Bergy D Bergy is offline
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It will get quite a bit worse, and the government is making sure that it will last longer than it would if they did nothing at all.

On the bright side, we will pull through it if people keep a level head about them. Spend much less and plant a food garden. Gold will easily double in a year. I keep guns and ammunition all of the time for both hunting and if things get way out of hand. You can hardly buy guns or ammunition now. Since Obama has been elected, it seems lots of people are stocking up on both. Shortages are statewide in the North.

If you are fairly well set, you can buy real estate real cheap in many areas. There is $8,000 the government will pay you if you buy a house and are a first time home buyer. It is good for this year up to December 1st. Do not buy a mansion, just what you need. Banks are loaded with empty houses and everything is negotiable.

We will be in a better place in a few years, but it will not be for at least five years, and that is being optimistic. I have lost half of my retirement fund, but who the heck cares. I have everything I need, and I will not go hungry.

Dan
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Old 03-09-2009, 06:39 AM
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I'm sure we will pull through it as a nation...but how long will it take and at what price for the people to pay?

We purchased a hunting rifle last week. No problems in finding what we wanted... just that we were in the market for a used gun, we always purchase big ticket items used if we can and there just aren't any around right now.

This summer we will start developing a garden on our land, the composting, water system, fencing and all.
I just purchased a 7 quart "All American" pressure canner and I've been stocking up on mason jars. If you wait to purchase mason jars till harvest time you will not find any!
Next purchase will be a chain saw.

Since we are not prepared for the survival mode there is a lot of spending going on right now...If you have no place to go that is closer to nature start looking at your yard and what you need to do to make it a productive garden. Look into purchasing heirloom seeds, non genetically modified seed... If you have no garden space what so ever look into making agreements with friends or neighbors who do.

We are spending now, somewhat prematurely, because we feel that inflation is right around the corner and then a potential dollar collapse.

My son it thinking of looking for a house this summer but I am concerned that he might get a house then loose his job. He plans on renting rooms out in it to college students so maybe it will be ok. If the economy totally falls apart I do not think people who have mortgages will be moved out of their houses for lack of payment...but yes, in this early stage, people are being moved out. The longer you can hold on the better.

I'm sorry you lost half your retirement fund Dan.. So far our 401Ks have not been hurt and I'm keeping our fingers crossed. They were in the most conservative investments, but I still think they are at risk. If bonds and T bills go down we are lost. Where we are loosing is in the value of our house, if we can sell it at all. It goes on the market this spring. We are fortunate enough to live in a state that is not so hard hit yet but still there are quite a few foreclosures around, not right near us though. I do expect when spring comes we will be seeing for sale signs everywhere around us.

We won't go hungry. I've seen to that.
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Old 03-09-2009, 07:10 AM
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Default Victory Gardens

During WWII a group of officers in the military were provided with land and told to plant a Victory Garden. So the group got together and made one big garden where they planted only one crop, watermelons.
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Old 03-09-2009, 07:18 AM
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Yes, and that concept was the start of the Victory Garden Seed company, I think. They sell heirloom seeds... a fine company.

and welcome to the forum BigAl


A History of the Victory Garden - Page 2
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Old 03-09-2009, 08:15 AM
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Arrow, your preparation is very impressive. I was always way too optimistic, but the economy seems getting worse and worse. I definitely need to plan my future a bit better. I started to pay mortgage just a year ago - a very bad timing.
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Old 03-09-2009, 12:27 PM
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Default Old friends

Arrow, thanks for the greeting but we are old friends. We met on another network and I still owe you a big hug for the information you posted on mms. Now I live on it.

If any one is hesitating about having a garden, they shouldn't be. My wife and I have lots of good and funny stories to tell of our many gardening experiences.

As for economic hard times. Back in the the late sixties I wrote lots of letters to a newspaper encouraging people not to buy imports or else. And I also placed cards all around saying, "Show your true colors. Buy made in the USA" Apparently an ad man for Wal Mart saw one of my cards and because Sam Walton was of this same mind Wal Mart came out with the slogan: Show your colors. Unfortunately that slogan didn't go over. Also about that same time I heard a talk by the economist, Milton Friedman, who said it was a good thing to buy imports. So the prospects for prosperity have always bucked a head wind.
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Old 03-09-2009, 12:37 PM
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Hi Al. pm me. I wonder what forum? Glad you are doing well

They say Gerald Celente of Trends Research Institute has a high degree of accuracy.






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Old 03-09-2009, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigAl View Post
If any one is hesitating about having a garden, they shouldn't be. My wife and I have lots of good and funny stories to tell of our many gardening experiences.
It's not an option for me, but I would love to hear some gardening tips and stories. Mad Scientest is good at home improvement and electronics. We can have a sub-forum on these topics.
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Old 03-09-2009, 06:08 PM
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Arrow what you say makes sense these are the same trends that I have been watching. Of course back then when predictions were made that the Dow would drop to 8000 maybe 6000 this caused many of the talking heads to just laugh and say that is was absurd. Now they are running around trying to figure out what went wrong and calling for band aid’s when major surgery is required. This is my take on what is going on.

From what I have read it is my belief that major portion of this problem can be laid in the lap of the Federal Reserve Bank. Although this is not to say that our politicians of both parties through some of their “enlightened” legislation haven’t contributed greatly to the problem.

The reason the FRB was created, we were told, was to control inflation and the ups and downs of the business cycles. It has obviously failed miserably on both accounts. We need only look at our personal history to see that this is true. In my case about 35 year’s ago I built my current home. At the time in round numbers it cost $50,000. To day, well maybe a year ago, it was worth $500,000. So the average person would look at that and say “Wow you made a good investment.” But was it really?

If this were really true then I should be able to sell it, stay in the same area and build a new home 10 times bigger with my so called “profit”. Yet the reality is the best that I could hope to do is buy a house of essentially the same size. So the real reality here, something that few look at, is that the intrinsic value of my home has not changed the only thing that that has changed is it dollar value! And this represents a 10 fold decrease in the value of our dollar or otherwise know as inflation. The very thing the FRB is suppose to be controlling.

So what is going on? Do we even need the FED? Why do we have it in the first place? The constitution gives the government the sole right to “coin” money. So why did our illustrious congress turn this right over to a private bank. (Actually a group of banks, some of which are not even American owned.) The reason is actually quite simple, the bankers wanted take control of the country and they did this by taking controlling of our money. All that they needed to do was buy up enough politicians who it turn passed the FRB act. This put them in control of our money and not congress. This meant that whenever the government needed money it would now barrow it from these banks, and of course pay interest on the loaned money, rather then print it itself interest free. Such a deal, with friends like this who needs enemies?

But that was not enough, they then lobbied for and got the gold standard removed as his was too restraining on their ability to control our money. Which is precisely why one would want the gold standard. So now that the government was barrowing money rather then printing it, it now needed a source of income to pay back the loans plus the interest charged. Thus we have the real reason that the income tax was instated.

Note when you pay our taxes you make the check out the FRB not the federal government. However many people naturally assume that because the FRB has “federal” in its name it must be part of the government. That did not happen by accident. Again the reality here is that the FRB is no more part of the federal government then Federal Express is. They are both private companies.

Now with the FRB in control of our currency they could start playing games with credit. People were encouraged to buy on credit, banks were allowed to loan more money then they had in reserve. Of course you as a barrower still had to put up real collateral to get a non-money backed loan.

Here is how this system works to create money out of thin air. First the FRB loans some money to a bank. That bank is then allowed to loan out 10 times that amount with the assumption that their 10% in real cash will be enough to cover any loans that are defaulted on. Now you go to that bank and take out a loan to lets say build a house, you are then given credit to use some of these imaginary dollars. You then put that money in your bank to be used as needed, however in the mean time your bank now has a bunch of “new” money that it can it loan out at 10 times its face value. Then if I go to your bank and take out a loan and but it in my bank this process repeats. With enough transactions it is even possible for the original bank to receive some of it original imaginary money back thus allowing it to loan out even more!

Isn’t this is a great system? Everyone is making money hand over fist, and the more loans that are made the better. The politicians were then lobbied to change the laws and make it even easier for anyone to get a loan, even if they were not qualified to pay it back. Then as planed when these high risk loans started to fail and thus this whole house of cards started to collapse little banks are bought by big banks which turn are bought out by bigger banks with most of it being done for pennies on the dollar. While much of these assets were now worthless still along with them came the very real collateral that people had put up. This allowed the transfer/confiscation of large amounts of real wealth and property into a handful of very influential individuals.

This is what was done during the great depression as a means to transfer wealth from the great unwashed peons of the country to the hands of few elite who were obviously much better able to appreciate its value.

When Bemanke first took office he confirmed that the FRB was the cause of the great depression. But that he wouldn’t let it happen again. Yah right.

However it would seem that the real “powers that be” have decided that it is again time to fleece the sheeple.


OK who wants my aluminum foil covered hat next?
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Old 03-09-2009, 06:45 PM
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It's not an option for me, but I would love to hear some gardening tips and stories. Mad Scientest is good at home improvement and electronics. We can have a sub-forum on these topics.

I like that idea. Having a spot for various survival based topics could prove to be very helpful.
This would be a good place for everyone to share their ideas tips on everything from gardening, to canning, energy saving ideas, or how to make things for yourself or others rather then having to buy them, etc.
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Old 03-09-2009, 07:18 PM
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OK who wants my aluminum foil covered hat next?

Me but only because I like trying hats on.lol

Nice write up, enjoyed reading it.
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Old 03-10-2009, 05:44 PM
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Mad Scientist says "Here is how this system works to create money out of thin air. First the FRB loans some money to a bank. That bank is then allowed to loan out 10 times that amount with the assumption that their 10% in real cash will be enough to cover any loans that are defaulted on. Now you go to that bank and take out a loan to lets say build a house, you are then given credit to use some of these imaginary dollars. You then put that money in your bank to be used as needed, however in the mean time your bank now has a bunch of “new” money that it can it loan out at 10 times its face value. Then if I go to your bank and take out a loan and but it in my bank this process repeats. With enough transactions it is even possible for the original bank to receive some of it original imaginary money back thus allowing it to loan out even more! "

My son who is a business major explained this to me a while back.

So what do we go to gold? I don't think there is enough gold in the world to go around unless it increases massively in value.

The only thing that is truly worth anything is labor, land and natural resources. Labor can easily be traded. The value of gold and silver is only a belief.

A survival forum might be of interest. Actually, I post already on a forum dedicated to it but we could do it here.
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Old 03-10-2009, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Arrowwind09 View Post

I don't think there is enough gold in the world to go around unless it increases massively in value.
The reason a gold standard works is precisely because it is relatively scarce thus it tends to hold is value.

On the other hand I suppose we could just print some numbers on a piece of paper and claim that it is valuable.
That might work if we limited the amount that we printed.
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