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Old 10-27-2012, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by MechMike View Post

Doxycycline 100mg 2x day
Bromelain 500mg 2x day
L'Arginine 1000mg 3x day
Bee Propolis 1000mg 3x day
Allicinmax 3capsules 3x day
Quercetin 500mg 3x day
Vit C 1400mg 3x day
Zinc Gluconate 25mg 1x day
Omega3 1000mg 3x day
Probiotic 2x day


Beta Glucan 250mg 2x day
I would add curcumin (95% or higher) 500mg 2x day and resveratrol (95% or higher) 400mg 2x day to the above list.

I would not suggest taking zinc without copper (2mg/day)
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  #1367  
Old 10-27-2012, 04:17 PM
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Hot Water Enema For Prostatitis

This can be done in the privacy of ones home, and some men have reported being cured.

A link for getting setup and what you need to perform a hot water enema is below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5kdIaD2QSY

(Note: I have never tried a hot water enema as of this posting, but I am considering giving it a try myself)
( I should also add if your prostate is swollen, you might consider giving this a try as well, as there is a chance it might actually shrink the gland as reported by a few men. As with any treatment option for prostatitis it will probably work for some men but not others. )

Also another way to perform this could be buying an enema bulb,feeling it with hot water, and then inserting in the rectum and squeezing hot water up your rear. only problem is what happens if you buy a bulb and it is not very sturdy and bursts open from the hot water. example of enema bulbs below.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CleanStream-...item3f189e8af6

http://www.ebay.com/itm/440-ml-woman...item337d2f3fba
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Old 10-28-2012, 01:17 PM
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I am only on the 3rd day of this regime ( baths and stretches for 1 week) and already feel somewhat better. Urinary urgency and stream noticebly improved and very little or no discomfort or pain. . . Somethings working!!!!
Can't help feel that with the ED that this may be a muscular or nerve thing for me. At first when I started the stretches it made the pain symptoms worse but now they seem to relax that whole area down there. I have to say that for me, the worst part of all this has been the ED. Am going to add pycnogenol 3x 40mg day to hopefully solve this. It definately all started as prostatitis because of the immediate effect the cipro had originally but hell knows what I am dealing with now. Hopefully I can organise to see a pelvic floor therapist to get some biofeedback to see exactly what my muscles are up to down there.
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Old 10-28-2012, 01:19 PM
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Thanks for the heads up about the copper with the zinc pinball. Did not know about that.
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Old 10-29-2012, 02:27 PM
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Hi Kindlefin,

My prostate fluid bacteria test showed also E.Coli and Enterococcus like you. Not Chlamydia though, but I don't think they did the fluorescent test that you described. Would it not show otherwise?

Anyway, I'm curious how you ended up taking those 2 antibiotics together. Was it by the doctor's request? Also can you describe the dosages and how well it worked?

Thanks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kindlefin View Post
Hi Harry,

I have finished Cipro plus Azythromycin combo basically for 40 days. Also I took daily Naproxen and had no issues at all. It eliminated most of the symptoms, there is still some tension there, therefore I can not confirm yet that it worked. Azythromycin is supposed to disrupt the biofilms from what I understand. I would not do one antibiotic anyway.
For example, azithromycin plus rifampicin was the most effective.
http://www.ijaaonline.com/article/S0...347-9/fulltext

I am also reading Lyme Disease protocols such as Marshal Protocol. I think it is receiving more recognition than Prostatitis and that is why there is more research on it. Looks like Clamydia Pnemonia is what is causing Lyme Disease, Arthritis and even Rosacea.
That is why I think Dr. Toth in NY is correct that most of the Prostatitis is caused by Chlamydia trachomatis.
You can reach out to Dr. Blaney that works with Marshall Protocol below. He works also with Chronic Prostatitis.
http://stillpointproject.com/service...consultations/


Take a look at this, by Gabe Mirkin, he is basically confirming that it would take Tequin plus doxy at least for 2 months
http://www.drmirkin.com/men/M156.html
http://www.drmirkin.com/morehealth/G144.htm
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Old 10-29-2012, 04:34 PM
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I wonder how many more people lurk the forums and research online, but almost always end up too overwhelmed to post anything.

The more you research and read, the more paths you see forming in front of you, and it's really disgusting and not fair for a patient, a sufferer, to bear that weight. To have that job.

For me, the 2 main paths are always whether there is a bacteria in there or this is just muscular/physical. Secretly I hope there is a bacteria, cause that means I just have to get the right antibiotic and I can have my life back in 2 or 3 days. That's why people hold on so hard to that theory.

Anyway, now my situation:
I've had this for 2.5 years, tried a few antibiotics, they mostly haven't done shit.
But on the other hand, I've had 1 bacteria culture positive for e.coli and enterococcus. That was last year, since then I've had 2 negative cultures.
So, I'm always arguing with myself whether this is bacteria or muscular.
A couple more arguments for each side:
- I do have perineum/pelvic pain that stretching seems to help. Also swimming helps. I don't feel pain when swimming. If I do weight lifting like yesterday, then I'll have pain the following days.
- I also have pain the day(s) after ejaculation. Apart from the pain, my prostate gets swollen and clogged, or at least that's how I feel it is. That's the one symptom that for me doesn't fit the pelvic pain theory. tex and Johny1, did/do you also have that?

I did the Iwillbecured protocol like 1.5 times. I'm doing a variation of it at the moment. It's not helping much. Doxy kinda makes me feel a little bit better but it stays like that. No flare-ups.

I found a doctor that does massages daily with antibiotic. It really impressed me that he could milk the prostate. All the other doctors I've seen just did the DRE. This one diagnosed me with prostatis by pressing hard in several spots and seeing that that caused me pain. He says that in people without prostatis that is not painful. I'm not sure what to think about this to be honest. I guess it's the same question: do people with pelvic pain syndrome also have inflammed prostates or that only comes from bacteria?

Anyway, I'm planning a new protocol. My last stance against a possible bacterial prostatitis. Out of the positive bacteria culture I had, both bacterias were sensitive to cipro. I'm a bit concerned since I know that levofloxacin is better for enterococcus but hey, if it said it's sensitive to cipro on the paper then I guess I should take that one and if the bacteria is still there, then I should probably feel some difference.
Also, I tried levofloxacin last year for about 10 days and I didn't feel a thing. Well actually, during that time I felt more tension there. I get that feeling from alpha blockers and 5-alpha-reductors. It's like, if I start taking it, within 2 days I feel worse in there. It's such a shame too, cause I read some stories of people feeling better after months of a-blocker.

If this doesn't work, I already have a non-bacterial plan
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  #1372  
Old 10-30-2012, 02:50 AM
MechMike MechMike is offline
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Pudendal Neuralgia Symptoms

http://www.pudendalhope.info/node/9

Worth a look. A lot of the symptoms are VERY similar to prostatitis.
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  #1373  
Old 10-30-2012, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hope4days View Post
I wonder how many more people lurk the forums and research online, but almost always end up too overwhelmed to post anything.

The more you research and read, the more paths you see forming in front of you, and it's really disgusting and not fair for a patient, a sufferer, to bear that weight. To have that job.

For me, the 2 main paths are always whether there is a bacteria in there or this is just muscular/physical. Secretly I hope there is a bacteria, cause that means I just have to get the right antibiotic and I can have my life back in 2 or 3 days. That's why people hold on so hard to that theory.

Anyway, now my situation:
I've had this for 2.5 years, tried a few antibiotics, they mostly haven't done shit.
But on the other hand, I've had 1 bacteria culture positive for e.coli and enterococcus. That was last year, since then I've had 2 negative cultures.
So, I'm always arguing with myself whether this is bacteria or muscular.
A couple more arguments for each side:
- I do have perineum/pelvic pain that stretching seems to help. Also swimming helps. I don't feel pain when swimming. If I do weight lifting like yesterday, then I'll have pain the following days.
- I also have pain the day(s) after ejaculation. Apart from the pain, my prostate gets swollen and clogged, or at least that's how I feel it is. That's the one symptom that for me doesn't fit the pelvic pain theory. tex and Johny1, did/do you also have that?

I did the Iwillbecured protocol like 1.5 times. I'm doing a variation of it at the moment. It's not helping much. Doxy kinda makes me feel a little bit better but it stays like that. No flare-ups.

I found a doctor that does massages daily with antibiotic. It really impressed me that he could milk the prostate. All the other doctors I've seen just did the DRE. This one diagnosed me with prostatis by pressing hard in several spots and seeing that that caused me pain. He says that in people without prostatis that is not painful. I'm not sure what to think about this to be honest. I guess it's the same question: do people with pelvic pain syndrome also have inflammed prostates or that only comes from bacteria?

Anyway, I'm planning a new protocol. My last stance against a possible bacterial prostatitis. Out of the positive bacteria culture I had, both bacterias were sensitive to cipro. I'm a bit concerned since I know that levofloxacin is better for enterococcus but hey, if it said it's sensitive to cipro on the paper then I guess I should take that one and if the bacteria is still there, then I should probably feel some difference.
Also, I tried levofloxacin last year for about 10 days and I didn't feel a thing. Well actually, during that time I felt more tension there. I get that feeling from alpha blockers and 5-alpha-reductors. It's like, if I start taking it, within 2 days I feel worse in there. It's such a shame too, cause I read some stories of people feeling better after months of a-blocker.

If this doesn't work, I already have a non-bacterial plan

[[ I found a doctor that does massages daily with antibiotic. It really impressed me that he could milk the prostate. All the other doctors I've seen just did the DRE. This one diagnosed me with prostatis by pressing hard in several spots and seeing that that caused me pain. He says that in people without prostatis that is not painful. I'm not sure what to think about this to be honest. I guess it's the same question: do people with pelvic pain syndrome also have inflammed prostates or that only comes from bacteria? ]]

Jackpot, finding a urologist who actually knows what he is doing is extremely rare, I like the fact that he knew that if a person was in pain when he pressed the prostate he knew they had prostatiitis. I have went to urologists and I would be screaming and cursing in pain during a rectal exam as they pressed, then tell me everything seems fine, they fail to realize that a DRE is not supposed to cause pain.

Veterinarians who suspect dogs or cats of prostate issues, always check to see if the rectal wall and prostate is sensitive in animals using a DRE. If a dog or cat starts whining in pain, that lets them know the animal has prostate issues. It amazes me that most urologists tell their patients they are fine when they are in immense pain during a rectal exam. Sounds like you have a smart urologist because he realizes what most in his profession do not.

You could try three time weekly prostate massages with your urologist and see if it helps you.
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  #1374  
Old 10-31-2012, 05:20 AM
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Well day 6 of the abx/supps/stretching routine and my symptoms have been getting steadily better. I changed my supplement routine slightly.

Doxycycline 100mg 2x day
Bromelain 500mg 2x day
L'Arginine 1000mg 4x day
Bee Propolis 1000mg 3x day
Allicinmax 3capsules 3x day
Quercetin 500mg 3x day
Vit C 1400mg 3x day
Zinc Gluconate 15mg + Copper 0.75mg 2x day
Omega3 1000mg 3x day
Probiotic 2x day
Beta Glucan 250mg 2x day
Vit D3 10,000iu 1x day
Pycnogenol 30mg 4x day
Vit E 400iu 1x day
Cranberry concentrate 840mg 2x day
Curcumin (to be added , in the post)
Also hot sitz baths 30mins after the morning and night abx/supps and then 20mins pelvic stretching 2x day + making a point to try and relax the pelvic floor throughout the day.

I have stopped drinking coffee and black tea and instead have 2 or 3 mugs of green tea a day and plenty of water.

My urinary symptoms have much improved. I feel like now all I have to do is relax to urinate rather than force it out. and the stream is much improved. . . . . Also I was able to achieve a full erection last night for the first time in a while . Somethings working.

Now all I have to do is convince the doctor to extend my course of abx to 2months instead of 2 weeks. I don't know if it's the supps stretching or abx thats havin the right effect but I don't want to chance coming off the abx after 2weeks and allow any bacteria to become resistant like happened originally with my 2week course of cipro.

Best of luck to all of you, I will continue to post to keep everyone updated. I know I may be new to this forum but it is this thread (and the loss of my missus ) that has give me the strength to not give up and try and beat this thing. So thanks all.
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  #1375  
Old 10-31-2012, 09:34 AM
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I am just stunned at how you guys keep using medicine that you know won't work.

the true sign of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

In this case the cure of a disease that antibiotics had not previously responded to.

especially for you Harry Crumb.

Those with any brains left will go to www.gensis2church.org and read read read and then they will try MMS
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  #1376  
Old 10-31-2012, 11:24 AM
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When I was reading through this yesterday, I was hoping you (Arrow) would post a reply regarding the antibiotic use and overuse, so thankyou for that. MMS would be a much better choice.

I have also been researching vitamin C again, as there are well over 5000 studies now as well as several papers, and I recently read the following:

http://www.orthomed.com/titrate.htm


TABLE I - USUAL BOWEL TOLERANCE DOSES

GRAMS ASCORBIC ACID
CONDITION PER 24 HOURS
normal --------------- 4-15
mild cold-------------- 30-60
severe cold----------- 60-100+
influenza-------------- 100-150
ECHO, coxsackievirus -- 100-150
mononucleosis -------- 150-200+
viral pneumonia ------- 100-200+
hay fever, asthma----- 15-50
environmental and
food allergy -----------0.5-50
burn, injury, surgery----25-150+
anxiety, exercise and
other mild stresses----- 15-25
cancer ---------------- 15-100
ankylosing spondylitis--- 15-100
Reiter's syndrome------- 15-60
acute anterior uveitis--- 30-100
rheumatoid arthritis----- 15-100
bacterial infections----- 30-200+
infectious hepatitis----- 30-100
candidiasis------------- 15-200+

Bowel tolerance increases directly proportional to the seriousness of the illness.

Notice that all 200+ daily oral vitamin c doses are for mono, viral pneumonia, bacterial infections, and candida. (yeast)

Also notice that candidiasis would require a larger daily dose than for cancer!

ANASCORBEMIA -- ACUTE INDUCED SCURVY

It is well established that certain symptoms are associated with an almost total lack of vitamin C within the body. Symptoms of scurvy include lassitude, malaise, bleeding gums, loss of teeth, nosebleeds, bruising, hemorrhages in any part of the body, easy infections, poor healing of wounds, deterioration of joints, brittle and painful bones, and death, etc. It is thought that this disease only occurs with dietary deprivation of vitamin C. However, an analogous condition is produced as follows:

Well-nourished humans usually contain not much more than 5 grams of vitamin C in their bodies. Unfortunately, the majority of people have far less ascorbate than this amount in their bodies and are at risk for many problems related to failure of metabolic processes dependent upon ascorbate. This condition is called CHRONIC SUBCLINICAL SCURVY.

If a disease is toxic enough to allow for the person's potential consumption of 100 grams of vitamin C, imagine what that disease must be doing to that possible 5 grams of ascorbate stored in the body. A condition of ACUTE INDUCED SCURVY is rapidly induced. Some of this increased metabolic need for ascorbate undoubtedly occurs in areas of the body not primarily involved in the disease and can be accounted for by such functions as the adrenals producing more adrenaline and corticoids; the immune system producing more antibodies, interferon, and other substances to fight the infection; the macrophages utilizing more ascorbate with their increased activity; and the production and protection of c-AMP and c-GMP with the subsequent increased activity of other endocrine glands, etc. Also, there must be a tremendous draw on ascorbate locally by increased metabolic rates in the primarily infected tissues.

The infecting organisms themselves liberate toxins which are neutralized by ascorbate, but in the process destroy ascorbate. The levels of ascorbate in the nose, throat, eustachian tubes, and bronchial tubes locally infected by a 100 gram cold must be very low indeed. With this acute induced scurvy localized in these areas, it is small wonder that healing can be delayed and complications such as chronic sinusitis, otitis media, and bronchitis, etc. develop.

I had assumed that much of this ascorbate was used for functions somehow directly related to neutralizing the toxicity of viral and bacterial diseases. When ill, one has the internal sense that something of this nature is happening when bowel tolerance is approached. Recently, however, I had the personal experience of ingesting 48 grams in an hour and a half when I had a sudden hay fever reaction to roses. Upon withdrawal from the roses tolerance dropped rapidly to normal. This experience plus my experiences with many patients under emotional stress, would indicate that the adrenals are capable of utilizing large amounts of ascorbate with benefit if it is made available.

This draw on ascorbate, from whatever source, lowers the blood level of ascorbate to a negligible level. I have coined the term ANASCORBEMIA for this condition. If this anascorbemia is not rapidly rectified by the oral administration of bowel tolerance doses of ascorbic acid or by intravenous administration of ascorbate, the remainder of the body is rapidly depleted of ascorbate and put at risk for disorders of the metabolic processes dependent upon vitamin C.

The following problems should be expected with increased incidence with severe depletion of ascorbate: disorders of the immune system such as secondary infections, rheumatoid arthritis and other collagen diseases, allergic reactions to drugs, foods and other substances, chronic infections such as herpes, or sequelae of acute infections such as Guillain-Barre' and Reye's syndromes, rheumatic fever, or scarlet fever; disorders of the blood coagulation mechanisms such as hemorrhage, heart attacks, strokes, hemorrhoids, and other vascular thrombosis; failure to cope properly with stresses due to suppression of the adrenal functions such as phlebitis, other inflammatory disorders, asthma and other allergies; problems of disordered collagen formation such as impaired ability to heal, excessive scarring, bed sores, varicose veins, hernias, stretch marks, wrinkles, perhaps even wear of cartilage or degeneration of spinal discs; impaired function of the nervous system such as malaise, decreased pain tolerance, tendency to muscle spasms, even psychiatric disorders and senility; and cancer from the suppressed immune system and carcinogens not detoxified; etc. Note that I am not saying that ascorbate depletion is the only cause of these disorders, but I am pointing out that disorders of these systems would certainly predispose to these diseases and that these systems are known to be dependent upon ascorbate for their proper function.

Not only is there the theoretical probability that these types of complications associated with infections or stresses could result from ascorbate depletion, but there was a conspicuous decrease in the expected occurrence of complications in the thousands of patients treated with oral tolerance doses or intravenous doses of ascorbate. This impression of marked decrease in these problems is shared by physicians experienced with the use of ascorbate such as Klenner and Kalokerinos.
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Old 10-31-2012, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arrowwind09 View Post
I am just stunned at how you guys keep using medicine that you know won't work.

the true sign of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

In this case the cure of a disease that antibiotics had not previously responded to.

especially for you Harry Crumb.

Those with any brains left will go to www.gensis2church.org and read read read and then they will try MMS
Nice Albert Einstein quote.

Funny you should say that arrow wind, I've been to a lot of different forums. And it seems that is just what everybody with prostatitis does, they keep taking antibiotics just waiting for the stuff to work, even though they know it is futile. I know deep down it is insanity, I think most of us know that it is not going to get rid of this for us, call it a desperate move, or a struggle for survival. A lot of sufferers on this site seem to try to keep a jolly smiley face going on for some reason, maybe it's the thought of the cure is somewhere around the corner. I've talked to men who have had this disease for decades. And I'll quote the man who who has had prostatitis for 25 years now ... Quote " There is no cure"
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Old 11-03-2012, 10:38 PM
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Been doing the hot water enemas, done it for the 2nd day earlier.
decided to go with a very cheap saline enema bottle for a few bucks out walmart,then dumped the saline out of it. to see how I like it, no point in wasting $10 or $15 if it's not going to work. One thing I learned about the enema is you will crap after it, it flushes you out, I can also feel the hot water up in my pelvic area. usually after doing an enema my butthole and pelvic area will be a little sore from the hot water enema. I think the reason why is the hot water is working its way into all of those muscles. It has not helped symptoms yet, nor has it worsened symptoms either.

I can actually put my hand on the pelvic area after the enema and feel the heat directly on my pelvic area.

To bad I don't own a hot tube or jacuzzi, I bet setting in something like that with the water real hot for like an hour everyday would help relax the body.
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Old 11-05-2012, 11:07 AM
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A possible scenario for some men

minimum inhibitory concentration (MIC) is the lowest concentration of an antibiotic that will inhibit the visible growth of a microragnism after overnight incubation. MIC is generally regarded as the most basic laboratory measurement of the activity of an antimicrobial agent against an organism.


Lets say we have a guy named Bob Wilson and bob has been diagnosed chronic prostatitis, lets say bob has had it a while, and that bob indeed has ecoli causing all of his symptoms, in fact, ol bobs bacteria is cultured in the lab, the correct antibiotic pill, which ever one it is, is prescribed.

Lets say that whatever antibiotic pill bob is given, it takes 25 ug/ml of this pill to kill bobs ecoli infection. In other words 25 ug/ml is the minimum inhibitory concentration in that petri dish meaning nothing under 25 ug/ml of this particular antibiotic pill can kill this strain of ecoli.

Bob is then prescribed the antibiotic for 6 weeks.

But unfortunately for bob the max amount of this drug that can get into his prostate is 10 ug/ml, so at the end of bobs 6 weeks of the antibiotic of choice bob still has his prostatitis.

There is a huge difference in the amount of an antibiotic reaching good levels in other organs such as a kidney or bladder compared with a prostate. Not only that, if a person does have an infection and an antibiotic works and it is stopped and restarted a couple of times the organism will become used to that MIC, and it would take a higher MIC of that drug to kill said organism. which would explain why you are given a drug one time and within a few days you have an erection, maybe the anal pain is less, back pain better, those night sweats disappear etc. Then you are stopped off of that drug and given it later and it no longer works, because that bacteria has saw that drug before, and now it will take a higher MIC to have the same affect, which would be impossible at the same dosage, in fact the MIC may be impossible with that drug at any dosage from then on out.

And depending how sensitive the organism is, there might be a different family of antibiotics that this organism is very sensitive to, that it wouldn't take a very high MIC to kill "said organism". An example, lets say that for this ecoli strain there are some beta-lactam antibiotics in which it takes a exactly 8 ug/ml to kill "said" infection, and these antibiotics reach 8 - 9 ug/ml in the prostate, why not prescribe them instead ?

Typical Urologist Answer: I believe that the best antibiotics are the quinolones and that they can kill any organism that there is. I believe that the quinolone is the best antibiotic on the planet. And levaquin is the best antibiotic in the existence of mankind. We hate beta-lactam antibiotics, we don't like using those types of drugs, we believe quinolones are the best that there is.

My reply: Thanks for being narrow minded Mr. Urologist, you have doomed us all.
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Old 11-05-2012, 01:11 PM
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http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/e...vegeta/001.jpg

Link above to a photo I snapped, I asked Dr. Arnon Krongrad the urologist of the krongrad institute if this could happen, he admits to me in an email that it could happen.
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